For almost 17 years that I carred a badge I carried a S&W 357 on a K frame. style Tommy Gun Asking that question around gun owners is like bringing up religion or politics at a party. When dealing with a highly motivated target, milliseconds matter. Just bless his little Prsident heart. 9mm Luger offers greater magazine capacity and less recoil/more weapon control at a lower cost. LE, south LA and Watts for 8 1/2 out of 15 years. It depends where they get hit. My father was hit in the arm with a .50 bmg round during the Falklands war and it took his arm off from below the el The gun was designed prior to WW1 and its main usage was close combat in regards to trench warfare. View our Terms of Service Project: Aftermath Wiki. Now they have announced they are moving back to the 9mm in the form of the new Gen5 Glock 17M. Come join the discussion about optics, gunsmithing, styles, reviews, accessories, classifieds, and more! The 45 is the preferred for close combat, Common sense will tell you that if you are being overrun! ACP cystic fluid caused growth retardation and an increased obesity index in mice, affected the expression of the Npy, Fgfr2, Rnpc3, Sst, and Pcsk1n genes that regulate growth and energy metabolism in hypothalamic neurons, and enhanced the cellular interaction of AgrpMc3r. Using the cone attack gives you a low ammo condition that imposes disadvantage on attack rolls until you reload, and you have 2 reloads per day. round, you can see all three effects. Fire Rate: 240 Lethality by Caliber: Whats the Best Handgun Caliber For You? Its unlikely Id ever have to shoot at anything other than paper targets. One last thing, I love the MC but for a military branch that has prided itself on marksmanship, they went along all too easily to 5.56/.223 and away from a real rifle (M-14). and love a SA trigger. Also SOCOM has been using hollowpoint ammunition for years, but primarily against unsanctioned terrorist personnel. career to carry a Glock 9mm. I am just way more comfortable with the way it shoots. Psychological factors play a much greater role. However, caliber is at least as important and should not be ignored when choosing a weapon. Most people ask to be shot with the 9mm instead of the .45acp. Because head shots are rare and extremely difficult, and torso hits are likewise difficult and do not result in immediate incapacitation, choosing handgun bullets for officers is a critically important task. Makes no difference to me. .45 ACP is not the one-shot-stopping hammer that some people think it is. What damage can a .45 caliber bullet do to a human? - Quora I have used both calibers personally in combat, and I can say unequivocally and without any doubt whatsoever that the .45 cal DEFINITELY has much more knockdown power than the 9mm which due to its higher velocity tends to punch right through the assailant leaving him wounded but still on his feet and able to return fire. Open the tools menu in your browser. I own 9mm, .40 and .45. I have never personally tested 9mm long range, but I have seen 45 Auto results. I have been hand loading my rifle and pistol ammo since 1975. Wounding one enemy combatant to take three out of the fight (or at least two) was a good argument when we were facing civilized enemies such as the Germans in WW II. But to suggest they made the change due to the reasons quoted aboveparticularly because the 9mm supposedly has greater penetration due to less air resistanceis complete hogwash! Unless they needed concealablity. There was no blood on the floor below him. While, I understand that budgetary issues are a factor they should not come before the safety of the officer pr soldier. I carry a Sig P226 9mm, or a Springfield 1911 in 45. Why is .45 acp so much better than 9mm? 3, both hemolymph ACP and AKP activities of P. clarkii were significantly decreased in the 30 and 50 mg/L groups compared to the control (P < 0.01).Similarly, PO activity also exhibited a significant reduction in the 30 mg/L group (P < 0.05) and the 50 mg/L group (P < 0.01), respectively.However, LZM activity showed a significant increase Note that buying a handgun for personal protection is not an abstract desire. WebRock Island Armory 1911 Rock Ultra CS Fiber Optic 45 ACP Sub-Compact 7-Round Pistol $ 679 99 679 dollars 99 cents $ 699 99 699 dollars 99 cents. Not to mention costs savings in ammo which is a big deal both in the government and civilian perspective. Or 45 cal quickly changes the perspective f the individual. If you shoot someone through the skull with a .22 rimfire and penetrate their brain, you will almost certainly immediately incapacitate them. You're Dead: 5 Deadliest Bullets In The World They're just as important as the gun that fires them. The Krag was a failure for two reasons. Its only a pistol. Ive never liked Glock its sure a well made gun but definitely NOT the best gun Ive shot. I have never fired a .45 but rarely find the grips comfortable when I pick them up. The flesh can tear and cells can burst as the tissue erupts outward and then slams back. This is why, when training with a firearm, you should train for the center of mass, regardless of target anatomy or angle. It enters the human body at energies approaching the speed of light and The .50 That still dont make them experts but better than the average person. CHEERS. I just had to get my 2 cents in. A little back ground, for almost 17 years that I carried a badge I carried a S&W 6 357 on a K frame as my service carry. They are a secondary source at best. If the first bullet ricochets off the windshield, the succeeding rounds will make it through. No regrets. Everything I understand and everything I have read and looked into if persons really going to throw down its going to be less than 15 yards and closer, at that point and Im just being honest I dont even use my rear sights once I get within 10 yards of a silhouette Im just going off at the front sight Focus and thats it, I compensate for the offset not using the rear sights by dropping the front sight a couple inches lower to anticipate the recoil and it is very accurate. Media in category "Human body" The following 64 files are in this category, out of 64 total. I think it is more the exception than the rule. Their over 800 FPS and some approaching 900 FPS with the hotter +P loads. Oh, and Sgt. A .45 ACP will encounter greater resistance than a 9mm, but it also carries more weight, albeit at a slower velocity. High-velocity In fact, the .223 projectile, a common round for the AR-15, is not much larger than many .22 rounds like the Hornet, typically used for youth shooting sports, target shooting, and hunting varmints. The germans used 9mm forever and they know their guns and war making. Platt was killed at the end of the gunfight, but not before unleashing deadly mayhem. Shot placement is the only thing that matters a perfect shot placement with a .22 gets the job done where a miss with a 50 cal just causes a little blood. Now for long engagements that are seen more in military ops and where fire suppression matters most I prefer 9mm. Bottom line, if you come at me and I shoot you with my 9 mm or my 45, or my 380, its going to hurt like hell! In stark contrast, the vast majority of incidents involving .40 S&W and .45 ACP resulted in gunshot victims being DRT; they dropped and expired right where they were initially shot, even with imperfect shot placement. Sad. Where aim for the middle of the whole body. By the way. Immediately retired the Glock 17 and requalified with a Glock 21 Gen 4 after a long break. With civilians Mosher shootings occur within 7 yards thats 21 feet are closer usually closer. They are both capable of inflicting mortal wounds far beyond practical range. 9mm will not drop a target unless you hit the CNS.a buddy of mine took a 9mm straight through the head through his eyeball from about 20 yards away. There are other similar handgun calibers, such as the .44 Special and the .45 Colt, and of course, the .357 SIG and 10mm Auto are WebWhen youre in the midst of dealing with an attack, the reduction in blood flow to your hands (along with the chemical changes in your body) will likely result in an increase in your pain threshold. Looking back at the stories we told, and which stuck with us, during an eventful year. So youre that guy safe at home on the computer. And I suspect it could very well be the Sig P320 as it is the epitome of modular.. So you better have the biggest heaviest bullet going down range that you can possibly get. I think its preference and if you can conceal it. 2. Fire Rate: 1,000 rounds/minute. Okay 9s are cool, hold a lot of rounds, small recoil, cheap to shoot and buy. Riley, love your artical. I will address the people shooting the weapons in the military. When you purchase through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission, which supports our community. I used to work in inner city and poor crime ridden areas when all I had was the 45. 7.62 leads the damage potential, followed by 5.56, followed by 45 and finally 9 mm. If the technology got better for one caliber, it got better for all of them!! Especially when it carries nearly double the mass with the bullet? Dr. Peter Rhee is a trauma surgeon who operated on victims of the 2011 shooting at a political event in Tucson, Arizona, in which six people were killed and 13 wounded in a hail of 9mm bullets. Shooting another person is only done with the intention to, at the very least, incapacitate the subject to protect the physical safety of others. 125 gr 9 mm PB fully jacketed bullet will generally penetrate both skins of a car door. This article will define what the question which handgun round has the best stopping power? means, and offer unbiased information that will help the readers to make up their own minds on the subject. Thank you Rich if you need 15 rounds to put down the assailant youre in trouble already, I have not near the experience of some of the veterans in the service. In any event, I used that data when shopping for a lighter and more easily concealed EDC than my .357 magnum revolver and hi-cap .45 ACP. There are a number of reasons for a failure to incapacitate, including a lack of awareness of the wound, intense personal fortitude, extreme emotions or physiological effects both natural (adrenaline) or chemically-induced (drugs such as PCP, heroin and cocaine). It was by far the easiest serviced pistol in the field, go ahead and get the lighter frame lighter weight ceramic /plastic and all that junk its fine as long as youre in a urban environment. There is enough blood within the brain at any time to support conscious, voluntary action for 10 to 15 seconds even in the event of the destruction of the heart itself. Sadly, most government decisions like this are primarily based on cost effectiveness, not cartridge performance or effectiveness; thats the main reason I quit using military or LE decisions as a factor in my own carry decisions. I prefer the .45 ACP. The tests resulted in the selection in 1989 of the 10mm bullet as the most effective and accurate round for FBI agents to carry. It is also logical to assume that when the larger round enters a major body organ, the negative impact upon that organ will be more significant. Our team, our mission, our partners, and more. I have 9 mm and I own mostly 45 ACPs, I can conceal a combat Commander with a small of the back holster with shorts T-shirt and flip-flops and nobody will know its there. PS: I forgot to mention that as a SAW gunner I was allowed to carry an old .45 (Springfield Armory). Just my thoughts and observations over the years. there is no substitute for Cubic Inches. handgun on the UN Side. sledgehammer. Its a High Point .40S&W. This remained the norm in the FBI until May 2014. At that long distance, the .223 will slam into its target with almost twice the speed of the .22. Officially last year it was announced that DoD intends to move to hollowpoint ammunition with this new MHS gun (whichever one ends up winning the contract). The .22, meanwhile. And it is acceptable to me that they made at least some of their determination based on the need to accommodate smaller hands. The Simple Physics That Makes Some Bullets Deadlier Than The door has been opened and shut for good on John M. Browning's classic 1911 design. Shorter barrels or longer range of initial impact will likewise decrease the possibility of expansion. This gave the enemy a chance to still bury a spearhead in the shooters chest, before finally collapsing from internal damage and blood loss. .45 ACP (230gr) One of the main reasons why military personnel and many LEOs made the switch to 9mm handguns was because of the deeper bullet penetration. Another may be more easily rattled, where a head shot is possible but still iffy. He came up in this world initially through his 8-year experience with a state-level law enforcement agency in Colorado. Their explanation (other than increasing ammo capacity): bullet technology has come a long way since 1986. Its hard for Civilians to understand the firepower of the Military & Police, and what they can choose to bring to bear on their target, but we are responsible for each bullet fired, as Civilians! Also the .45 will ring your ears like hell and most self defense scenarios are you are not wearing ear protection. It got up and walked about 25 yards before falling. Do any one you know carry just ball rounds in their handguns? The louder the pop the more credence is added to his choice to continue in his efforts his engagement with you. If that were true, we would only have one size Shoe, Clothing Etc. F=MA always applies to the known laws of physics. Awareness of the injury (which often registers before pain), fear of death or greater injury, preconceived notions of what people do when theyre shot, as well as a simple desire to give up can all play a factor in psychologically incapacitating an attacker. This type of damage is known as permanent cavity. This would give them an edge regarding tissue displacement/destruction during a shooting incident where any advantage, however slight, would be welcome. Black Talon ammunition was The HRP is concerned with long-term health consequences of radiation exposure such as cancer, as well as adverse effects to the central nervous and cardiovascular systems. Hunt! We can, however, find the most destructive round we can handle and train with it regularly. This pits apples to apples and will once and for all lay to rest all this ludicrous debate. Your skull is very thick in places (base of the skull) and some bullets arent designed for that kind of penetration. We enjoy our 2nd amendment and want it protected and were prepared to give our life to defend our country. Head on over to the Concealed Carry Podcast for great audio content. Because bullet strikes to the torso will not immediately incapacitate an adversary and will not knock him to the ground, police officers need to use bullets that will neutralize an adversary as quickly as possible. The .45 is a bit harder to conceal so people may freak out. A 9 is a great backup. Cheap crap. by Kyle Mizokami Key Point: These are the bullets that will do the It's estimated that chronic kidney disease affects about one in seven American adults.